Dynomotion

Group: DynoMotion Message: 5709 From: tmday7 Date: 9/24/2012
Subject: Encoder wiring to KFLOP and Drive
Got a Gecko G320X DC servo drive and was wondering if the Encoder can be wired up to the Drive and KFLOP? Or is there some other route i should take. The servo and encoder will be on a rotary 4th axis controlled by Mach3.

Thanks,
Troy
Group: DynoMotion Message: 5710 From: Tom Kerekes Date: 9/24/2012
Subject: Re: Encoder wiring to KFLOP and Drive
Hi Troy,
 
I assume the encoder is single ended (not differential) ?
 
You should be able to wire it in parallel.  The problem you might have is with shielding, termination, and noise when sending a signal two places.  The KFLOP inputs are high impedance (not terminated with pull down resistors).  I looked at the Gecko site and I can't find any specification on the encoder inputs.  It is usually best to have a termination resistor on the end of a signal transmission line.  Otherwise the signal can ring and also have higher susceptibility to noise.  Double or too much termination can reduce the voltage level too much depending on the drive capability of the encoder.  Ideally one would scope the signal to determine what gives the cleanest shape.
 
So in summary I would try it but be prepared to add termination if necessary.
 
Regards
TK

Group: DynoMotion Message: 5711 From: tmday7 Date: 9/24/2012
Subject: Re: Encoder wiring to KFLOP and Drive
Hi Tom,
Its a incremental 10 pin differential. Us Digital E6-1024-500-1-L-H-D-B.

Cable piouts...
1 Ground Drain(connected on one end)
2 Ground Green w/ White Stripe
3 I- channel White w/ Orange Stripe
4 I+ channel Orange w/ White Stripe
5 A- channel White w/ Blue Stripe
6 A+ channel Blue w/ White Stripe
7 Power White w/ Green Stripe
8 NC -
9 B- channel White w/ Brown Stripe
10 B+ channel Brown w/ White Stripe

Does this mean i can use the other channels for KFLOP?

Troy

--- In DynoMotion@yahoogroups.com, Tom Kerekes <tk@...> wrote:
>
> Hi Troy,
>  
> I assume the encoder is single ended (not differential) ?
>  
> You should be able to wire it in parallel.  The problem you might have is with shielding, termination, and noise when sending a signal two places.  The KFLOP inputs are high impedance (not terminated with pull down resistors).  I looked at the Gecko site and I can't find any specification on the encoder inputs.  It is usually best to have a termination resistor on the end of a signal transmission line.  Otherwise the signal can ring and also have higher susceptibility to noise.  Double or too much termination can reduce the voltage level too much depending on the drive capability of the encoder.  Ideally one would scope the signal to determine what gives the cleanest shape.
>  
> So in summary I would try it but be prepared to add termination if necessary.
>  
> Regards
> TK
>
> From: tmday7 <brotroy7@...>
> To: DynoMotion@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Monday, September 24, 2012 5:52 PM
> Subject: [DynoMotion] Encoder wiring to KFLOP and Drive
>
>
>  
> Got a Gecko G320X DC servo drive and was wondering if the Encoder can be wired up to the Drive and KFLOP? Or is there some other route i should take. The servo and encoder will be on a rotary 4th axis controlled by Mach3.
>
> Thanks,
> Troy
>
Group: DynoMotion Message: 5712 From: Tom Kerekes Date: 9/24/2012
Subject: Re: Encoder wiring to KFLOP and Drive
Hi Troy,
 
I don't see why not.
 
TK

Group: DynoMotion Message: 5713 From: tmday7 Date: 9/24/2012
Subject: Re: Encoder wiring to KFLOP and Drive
So i would wire A+, B+ to drive and A-,B- to KFLOP?

Thanks again,
Troy

--- In DynoMotion@yahoogroups.com, Tom Kerekes <tk@...> wrote:
>
> Hi Troy,
>  
> I don't see why not.
>  
> TK
>
> From: tmday7 <brotroy7@...>
> To: DynoMotion@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Monday, September 24, 2012 7:00 PM
> Subject: [DynoMotion] Re: Encoder wiring to KFLOP and Drive
>
>
>  
> Hi Tom,
> Its a incremental 10 pin differential. Us Digital E6-1024-500-1-L-H-D-B.
>
> Cable piouts...
> 1 Ground Drain(connected on one end)
> 2 Ground Green w/ White Stripe
> 3 I- channel White w/ Orange Stripe
> 4 I+ channel Orange w/ White Stripe
> 5 A- channel White w/ Blue Stripe
> 6 A+ channel Blue w/ White Stripe
> 7 Power White w/ Green Stripe
> 8 NC -
> 9 B- channel White w/ Brown Stripe
> 10 B+ channel Brown w/ White Stripe
>
> Does this mean i can use the other channels for KFLOP?
>
> Troy
>
> --- In mailto:DynoMotion%40yahoogroups.com, Tom Kerekes <tk@> wrote:
> >
> > Hi Troy,
> >  
> > I assume the encoder is single ended (not differential) ?
> >  
> > You should be able to wire it in parallel.  The problem you might have is with shielding, termination, and noise when sending a signal two places.  The KFLOP inputs are high impedance (not terminated with pull down resistors).  I looked at the Gecko site and I can't find any specification on the encoder inputs.  It is usually best to have a termination resistor on the end of a signal transmission line.  Otherwise the signal can ring and also have higher susceptibility to noise.  Double or too much termination can reduce the voltage level too much depending on the drive capability of the encoder.  Ideally one would scope the signal to determine what gives the cleanest shape.
> >  
> > So in summary I would try it but be prepared to add termination if necessary.
> >  
> > Regards
> > TK
> >
> > From: tmday7 <brotroy7@>
> > To: mailto:DynoMotion%40yahoogroups.com
> > Sent: Monday, September 24, 2012 5:52 PM
> > Subject: [DynoMotion] Encoder wiring to KFLOP and Drive
> >
> >
> >  
> > Got a Gecko G320X DC servo drive and was wondering if the Encoder can be wired up to the Drive and KFLOP? Or is there some other route i should take. The servo and encoder will be on a rotary 4th axis controlled by Mach3.
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Troy
> >
>
Group: DynoMotion Message: 5714 From: TK Date: 9/24/2012
Subject: Re: Encoder wiring to KFLOP and Drive
Yes

TK

On Sep 24, 2012, at 8:04 PM, "tmday7" <brotroy7@...> wrote:

 

So i would wire A+, B+ to drive and A-,B- to KFLOP?

Thanks again,
Troy

--- In DynoMotion@yahoogroups.com, Tom Kerekes <tk@...> wrote:
>
> Hi Troy,
>  
> I don't see why not.
>  
> TK
>
> From: tmday7 <brotroy7@...>
> To: DynoMotion@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Monday, September 24, 2012 7:00 PM
> Subject: [DynoMotion] Re: Encoder wiring to KFLOP and Drive
>
>
>  
> Hi Tom,
> Its a incremental 10 pin differential. Us Digital E6-1024-500-1-L-H-D-B.
>
> Cable piouts...
> 1 Ground Drain(connected on one end)
> 2 Ground Green w/ White Stripe
> 3 I- channel White w/ Orange Stripe
> 4 I+ channel Orange w/ White Stripe
> 5 A- channel White w/ Blue Stripe
> 6 A+ channel Blue w/ White Stripe
> 7 Power White w/ Green Stripe
> 8 NC -
> 9 B- channel White w/ Brown Stripe
> 10 B+ channel Brown w/ White Stripe
>
> Does this mean i can use the other channels for KFLOP?
>
> Troy
>
> --- In mailto:DynoMotion%40yahoogroups.com, Tom Kerekes <tk@> wrote:
> >
> > Hi Troy,
> >  
> > I assume the encoder is single ended (not differential) ?
> >  
> > You should be able to wire it in parallel.  The problem you might have is with shielding, termination, and noise when sending a signal two places.  The KFLOP inputs are high impedance (not terminated with pull down resistors).  I looked at the Gecko site and I can't find any specification on the encoder inputs.  It is usually best to have a termination resistor on the end of a signal transmission line.  Otherwise the signal can ring and also have higher susceptibility to noise.  Double or too much termination can reduce the voltage level too much depending on the drive capability of the encoder.  Ideally one would scope the signal to determine what gives the cleanest shape.
> >  
> > So in summary I would try it but be prepared to add termination if necessary.
> >  
> > Regards
> > TK
> >
> > From: tmday7 <brotroy7@>
> > To: mailto:DynoMotion%40yahoogroups.com
> > Sent: Monday, September 24, 2012 5:52 PM
> > Subject: [DynoMotion] Encoder wiring to KFLOP and Drive
> >
> >
> >  
> > Got a Gecko G320X DC servo drive and was wondering if the Encoder can be wired up to the Drive and KFLOP? Or is there some other route i should take. The servo and encoder will be on a rotary 4th axis controlled by Mach3.
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Troy
> >
>
Group: DynoMotion Message: 7489 From: tmday7 Date: 5/17/2013
Subject: Re: Encoder wiring to KFLOP and Drive
Hello Tom,
If i wire my encoder of 4th axis to go to Servo Drive and KFLOP, will the motor settings in KFLOP be set to Closed Loop? Or is the loop handled by servo drive only?
Trying to get in my head just how this would work,the drive uses encoder to keep servo on track and then it would get data from another source (KFLOP) to adjust the servo motor further.
Wouldn't this cause some kind of "fight" between the drive and KFLOP?

Thanks,
Troy

--- In DynoMotion@yahoogroups.com, TK <tk@...> wrote:
>
> Yes
>
> TK
>
> On Sep 24, 2012, at 8:04 PM, "tmday7" <brotroy7@...> wrote:
>
> > So i would wire A+, B+ to drive and A-,B- to KFLOP?
> >
> > Thanks again,
> > Troy
> >
> > --- In DynoMotion@yahoogroups.com, Tom Kerekes <tk@> wrote:
> > >
> > > Hi Troy,
> > > Â
> > > I don't see why not.
> > > Â
> > > TK
> > >
> > > From: tmday7 <brotroy7@>
> > > To: DynoMotion@yahoogroups.com
> > > Sent: Monday, September 24, 2012 7:00 PM
> > > Subject: [DynoMotion] Re: Encoder wiring to KFLOP and Drive
> > >
> > >
> > > Â
> > > Hi Tom,
> > > Its a incremental 10 pin differential. Us Digital E6-1024-500-1-L-H-D-B.
> > >
> > > Cable piouts...
> > > 1 Ground Drain(connected on one end)
> > > 2 Ground Green w/ White Stripe
> > > 3 I- channel White w/ Orange Stripe
> > > 4 I+ channel Orange w/ White Stripe
> > > 5 A- channel White w/ Blue Stripe
> > > 6 A+ channel Blue w/ White Stripe
> > > 7 Power White w/ Green Stripe
> > > 8 NC -
> > > 9 B- channel White w/ Brown Stripe
> > > 10 B+ channel Brown w/ White Stripe
> > >
> > > Does this mean i can use the other channels for KFLOP?
> > >
> > > Troy
> > >
> > > --- In mailto:DynoMotion%40yahoogroups.com, Tom Kerekes <tk@> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Hi Troy,
> > > > ÂÂ
> > > > I assume the encoder is single ended (not differential) ?
> > > > ÂÂ
> > > > You should be able to wire it in parallel. The problem you might have is with shielding, termination, and noise when sending a signal two places. The KFLOP inputs are high impedance (not terminated with pull down resistors). I looked at the Gecko site and I can't find any specification on the encoder inputs. It is usually best to have a termination resistor on the end of a signal transmission line. Otherwise the signal can ring and also have higher susceptibility to noise. Double or too much termination can reduce the voltage level too much depending on the drive capability of the encoder. Ideally one would scope the signal to determine what gives the cleanest shape.
> > > > ÂÂ
> > > > So in summary I would try it but be prepared to add termination if necessary.
> > > > ÂÂ
> > > > Regards
> > > > TK
> > > >
> > > > From: tmday7 <brotroy7@>
> > > > To: mailto:DynoMotion%40yahoogroups.com
> > > > Sent: Monday, September 24, 2012 5:52 PM
> > > > Subject: [DynoMotion] Encoder wiring to KFLOP and Drive
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > ÂÂ
> > > > Got a Gecko G320X DC servo drive and was wondering if the Encoder can be wired up to the Drive and KFLOP? Or is there some other route i should take. The servo and encoder will be on a rotary 4th axis controlled by Mach3.
> > > >
> > > > Thanks,
> > > > Troy
> > > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
Group: DynoMotion Message: 7490 From: Tom Kerekes Date: 5/18/2013
Subject: Re: Encoder wiring to KFLOP and Drive
Hi Troy,

I don't think it usually makes sense to close the position loop in both KFLOP and the drive.  As long as Step Pulses to the drive are not lost then KFLOP can tell the drive exactly where it should be and the Drive can close the loop to make the encoder be at that position.

But there are two other reasons for feeding the encoder position back to KFLOP so KFLOP can keep track of the encoder position:

#1 - it can monitor how well the Drive is doing.  Trigger a following error if the error becomes too great and plot the errors during a move.

#2 - if the Drive has a fault or is disabled the commanded position will basically be lost.   On recovery the current position can be re-synch'ed to the current encoder position.  This is also what happens on your system when you switch to manual mode, move the axes around, then switch back to Automatic mode.

HTH
Regards
TK